What came first the laws of nature, or the universe?

[slickrick27]

Despite the Big Bang, “Cosmic Origins Remain a Mystery”

Did you know that evolutionary scientists can’t explain where space, time, matter, and energy came from?

answersingenesis.org

Alot of people don't know that the big bang theory doesn't explain the creation of the cosmos, but rather the evolution of it. So even if someone were to accept the big bang theory, where were the forces of nature before matter? If you believe in the laws of nature, they aren't physical, they aren't something we can see even with a telescope or microscope, but we know they are there and they exist. Kinda sounds like God to me, what do you think?

Despite the Big Bang, “Cosmic Origins Remain a Mystery”

Did you know that evolutionary scientists can’t explain where space, time, matter, and energy came from?

answersingenesis.org

Alot of people don't know that the big bang theory doesn't explain the creation of the cosmos, but rather the evolution of it. So even if someone were to accept the big bang theory, where were the forces of nature before matter? If you believe in the laws of nature, they aren't physical, they aren't something we can see even with a telescope or microscope, but we know they are there and they exist. Kinda sounds like God to me, what do you think?

If I were to believe that something came from nothing, there were still the laws and forces of nature that govern the entire universe. Which means there was still something even before matter existed. There had to of been some kind of energy, and we know through physics, energy can not be created from nothing.

 

[Gamma🍄Goblin]

Ahh the what came first question. The chicken or the egg?

 

[Super Kirbo]

Despite the Big Bang, “Cosmic Origins Remain a Mystery”

Did you know that evolutionary scientists can’t explain where space, time, matter, and energy came from?

answersingenesis.org

Alot of people don't know that the big bang theory doesn't explain the creation of the cosmos, but rather the evolution of it. So even if someone were to accept the big bang theory, where were the forces of nature before matter? If you believe in the laws of nature, they aren't physical, they aren't something we can see even with a telescope or microscope, but we know they are there and they exist. Kinda sounds like God to me, what do you think?


If I were to believe that something came from nothing, there were still the laws and forces of nature that govern the entire universe. Which means there was still something even before matter existed. There had to of been some kind of energy, and we know through physics, energy can not be created from nothing.

Using quantum mechanics, two different physics experiments prove it's possible to conjure energy from an energy vacuum—essentially pulling energy out of thin air—by teleporting energy across microscopic distances, helping bolster a 2008 theory from Japanese physicist Masahiro Hotta

 

[slickrick27]

Ahh the what came first question. The chicken or the egg?

Exactly. 💯 that's the perfect apology, that no matter what answer you pick your left with major issues.

Exactly. 💯 that's the perfect apology, that no matter what answer you pick your left with major issues.

Analogy *

Using quantum mechanics, two different physics experiments prove it's possible to conjure energy from an energy vacuum—essentially pulling energy out of thin air—by teleporting energy across microscopic distances, helping bolster a 2008 theory from Japanese physicist Masahiro Hotta

See essentially, it's a loaded question. Because either answer poses big problems. If energy can be created, then the laws of thermodynamics would be erroneous. And that means we're right back from start again.

 

[eksy]

Ahh the what came first question. The chicken or the egg?

An egg that was laid by a pre-chicken bird and contained the first chicken. Evolution 👍

 

[wiggins]

Despite the Big Bang, “Cosmic Origins Remain a Mystery”

Did you know that evolutionary scientists can’t explain where space, time, matter, and energy came from?

answersingenesis.org

Alot of people don't know that the big bang theory doesn't explain the creation of the cosmos, but rather the evolution of it. So even if someone were to accept the big bang theory, where were the forces of nature before matter? If you believe in the laws of nature, they aren't physical, they aren't something we can see even with a telescope or microscope, but we know they are there and they exist. Kinda sounds like God to me, what do you think?


If I were to believe that something came from nothing, there were still the laws and forces of nature that govern the entire universe. Which means there was still something even before matter existed. There had to of been some kind of energy, and we know through physics, energy can not be created from nothing.

I understand that the big bang may be the otherside of a black hole.

Big Bang's are probably occurring all the time as new universes are continually being created. I think that was one of that little spac wagon physicist Hawkins ideas.
The universe we are part of is only one of an infinite number.

 

[Bad Hippo]

Man came first.

Everything else came after he invented the words for it.

 

[Dolly]

Despite the Big Bang, “Cosmic Origins Remain a Mystery”

Did you know that evolutionary scientists can’t explain where space, time, matter, and energy came from?

answersingenesis.org

Alot of people don't know that the big bang theory doesn't explain the creation of the cosmos, but rather the evolution of it. So even if someone were to accept the big bang theory, where were the forces of nature before matter? If you believe in the laws of nature, they aren't physical, they aren't something we can see even with a telescope or microscope, but we know they are there and they exist. Kinda sounds like God to me, what do you think?


If I were to believe that something came from nothing, there were still the laws and forces of nature that govern the entire universe. Which means there was still something even before matter existed. There had to of been some kind of energy, and we know through physics, energy can not be created from nothing.

The term "Big Bang theory" is named so because it is the beginning point it describes. There are many other theories such as inflation theory, cyclic universe theory, string theory, etc etc. Some consider the vague possibility of a God theory too.


Regarding it being impossible in your words for 'something to come from nothing', where did God come from?

 

[Bad Hippo]

The term "Big Bang theory" is named so because it is the beginning point it describes. There are many other theories such as inflation theory, cyclic universe theory, string theory, etc etc. Some consider the vague possibility of a God theory too.


Regarding it being impossible in your words for 'something to come from nothing', where did God come from?

Asking a religious loon a fundamental question like that will get one of two responses:
1) God was always there.
2) Duh........?

 

[Dolly]

Asking a religious loon a fundamental question like that will get one of two responses:
1) God was always there.
2) Duh........?

Exactly, it's funny how some people are fine with the idea of an eternal, all-powerful God that randomly is just there as the origin of everything, but find the universe starting from a hot, dense state and expanding, and suddenly it's impossible to them. There's even recent scientific observations of instances of quantum fluctuation, where particles materialize out of empty space and then vanish. but no... lets stick with some random bloke in the sky shall we.

 

[mrln]

According to Genesis, God created animals first, so the chicken came first.
Were they not on Noahs Arc?

 

[Dolly]

According to Genesis, God created animals first, so the chicken came first.
Were they not on Noahs Arc?

He invented light first, so he could see what he was doing

 

[punkduck]

at the same time of course. no need to even think about it.

 

[Bad Hippo]

He invented light first, so he could see what he was doing

And God said "Let there be light" - crazy fucking deity, speaking to himself like that.

Also, speaking requires air molecules, with which to exhale, and cause to vibrate, hence producing sound. But he didn't apparently create the air at any point in the first week. Silly god, forgetting to create air.

 

[se7en.is.back]

Despite the Big Bang, “Cosmic Origins Remain a Mystery”

Did you know that evolutionary scientists can’t explain where space, time, matter, and energy came from?

answersingenesis.org

Alot of people don't know that the big bang theory doesn't explain the creation of the cosmos, but rather the evolution of it. So even if someone were to accept the big bang theory, where were the forces of nature before matter? If you believe in the laws of nature, they aren't physical, they aren't something we can see even with a telescope or microscope, but we know they are there and they exist. Kinda sounds like God to me, what do you think?


If I were to believe that something came from nothing, there were still the laws and forces of nature that govern the entire universe. Which means there was still something even before matter existed. There had to of been some kind of energy, and we know through physics, energy can not be created from nothing.

If you want to keep believing in god then you should probably stop reading up on science. It will disappoint you.

 

[Bruno Schulz]

I never understood the whole "Jealous God" thing. What kind of clingy weirdo is this God? If he existed I'd get the hell away from his insecure jealous ass before he killed me while saying through his blubbering teary sobs, "You see what you make me do?!"

 

[btmboi]

taking this conversation to a different level as I do enjoy these.


forget the pre "big bang" universe for a moment and you wonder what was there. something had to ignite this start. some say it is god, others are looking into the sciences. let's look at god, we always look at god in a very human way as if he is the "all mighty" but maybe science and theology have a common question with this.

what is god?

 

[Russellmark11]

The universe didn't matter until there was an observer to ask if it did. Until then it would have been considered nothing because it didn't have any meaning to anything that was inside it. Make sense? So it wouldn't be that the universe came from nothing it would be that the universe had no value so it existed but meant nothing. The observer gives it value and takes it from meaning nothing into meaning something because the observer needs it to be something.

taking this conversation to a different level as I do enjoy these.


forget the pre "big bang" universe for a moment and you wonder what was there. something had to ignite this start. some say it is god, others are looking into the sciences. let's look at god, we always look at god in a very human way as if he is the "all mighty" but maybe science and theology have a common question with this.

what is god?

If God is defined as your creator then our star the sun would be considered God because it's beginning created the planets. We come from the Earth which is why it's called mother Earth. This is where the term Starseed comes from. The dust seeds planted on the Earth by our star the sun that were watered by Gods(the sun) son that was created from the beginning and became the comet that brought water to Earth. Dust to Dust.

If you want to keep believing in god then you should probably stop reading up on science. It will disappoint you.

Proverbs 18:15
An intelligent heart acquires knowledge, and the ear of the wise seeks knowledge.

The term "Big Bang theory" is named so because it is the beginning point it describes. There are many other theories such as inflation theory, cyclic universe theory, string theory, etc etc. Some consider the vague possibility of a God theory too.


Regarding it being impossible in your words for 'something to come from nothing', where did God come from?

The Big Bang is called that because a scientist in the 1940's used the term incorrectly but since the term was so simple and easy to understand for the less educated it stuck and has been used ever since even tho it's not the correct term and in no way describes how the universe began.

And God said "Let there be light" - crazy fucking deity, speaking to himself like that.

Also, speaking requires air molecules, with which to exhale, and cause to vibrate, hence producing sound. But he didn't apparently create the air at any point in the first week. Silly god, forgetting to create air.

I speak in my head all the time. Speaking doesn't necessarily require sound. Speaking can be defined as to indicate by other than verbal means or to express using feeling.

I understand that the big bang may be the otherside of a black hole.

Big Bang's are probably occurring all the time as new universes are continually being created. I think that was one of that little spac wagon physicist Hawkins ideas.
The universe we are part of is only one of an infinite number.

If you can't experience the other universes then do they really exist? If something can never be felt or seen is it consider to have an existence? This comes from the Copenhagen interpretation.

Despite the Big Bang, “Cosmic Origins Remain a Mystery”

Did you know that evolutionary scientists can’t explain where space, time, matter, and energy came from?

answersingenesis.org

Alot of people don't know that the big bang theory doesn't explain the creation of the cosmos, but rather the evolution of it. So even if someone were to accept the big bang theory, where were the forces of nature before matter? If you believe in the laws of nature, they aren't physical, they aren't something we can see even with a telescope or microscope, but we know they are there and they exist. Kinda sounds like God to me, what do you think?


If I were to believe that something came from nothing, there were still the laws and forces of nature that govern the entire universe. Which means there was still something even before matter existed. There had to of been some kind of energy, and we know through physics, energy can not be created from nothing.

Energy would have existed outside of time and a fluctuation(maybe gravity) in Time pulled the energy into its dimension. Gravity plus energy=zero. This is because gravity is a negative force and energy a positive force thus we exist in a zero energy dimension.

Despite the Big Bang, “Cosmic Origins Remain a Mystery”

Did you know that evolutionary scientists can’t explain where space, time, matter, and energy came from?

answersingenesis.org

Alot of people don't know that the big bang theory doesn't explain the creation of the cosmos, but rather the evolution of it. So even if someone were to accept the big bang theory, where were the forces of nature before matter? If you believe in the laws of nature, they aren't physical, they aren't something we can see even with a telescope or microscope, but we know they are there and they exist. Kinda sounds like God to me, what do you think?


If I were to believe that something came from nothing, there were still the laws and forces of nature that govern the entire universe. Which means there was still something even before matter existed. There had to of been some kind of energy, and we know through physics, energy can not be created from nothing.

Objective perception causes one to not accept the intangible. You can't see gravity but you can demonstrate that it exists by letting go of an object.

 

[slickrick27]

The universe didn't matter until there was an observer to ask if it did. Until then it would have been considered nothing because it didn't have any meaning to anything that was inside it. Make sense? So it wouldn't be that the universe came from nothing it would be that the universe had no value so it existed but meant nothing. The observer gives it value and takes it from meaning nothing into meaning something because the observer needs it to be something.


If God is defined as your creator then our star the sun would be considered God because it's beginning created the planets. We come from the Earth which is why it's called mother Earth. This is where the term Starseed comes from. The dust seeds planted on the Earth by our star the sun that were watered by Gods(the sun) son that was created from the beginning and became the comet that brought water to Earth. Dust to Dust.


Proverbs 18:15
An intelligent heart acquires knowledge, and the ear of the wise seeks knowledge.


The Big Bang is called that because a scientist in the 1940's used the term incorrectly but since the term was so simple and easy to understand for the less educated it stuck and has been used ever since even tho it's not the correct term and in no way describes how the universe began.


I speak in my head all the time. Speaking doesn't necessarily require sound. Speaking can be defined as to indicate by other than verbal means or to express using feeling.


If you can't experience the other universes then do they really exist? If something can never be felt or seen is it consider to have an existence? This comes from the Copenhagen interpretation.


Energy would have existed outside of time and a fluctuation(maybe gravity) in Time pulled the energy into its dimension. Gravity plus energy=zero. This is because gravity is a negative force and energy a positive force thus we exist in a zero energy dimension.

Even if energy existed outside of time, that means it still existed and we run into the same problem as to where energy came from. Even if you explain away how the universe started with the big bang, your still left with this problem of where energy came from. And we have another dilemma, about the laws of nature. If they are neither unseen or physical how do they exist?

 

[Dolly]

The Big Bang is called that because a scientist in the 1940's used the term incorrectly but since the term was so simple and easy to understand for the less educated it stuck and has been used ever since even tho it's not the correct term and in no way describes how the universe began.

Nope
Fred Hoyle used the term "Big Bang" to mock the theory proposed by Georges Lemaître because he disagreed with it. However, the term ended up being widely accepted and used to describe the theory. He didn't use it incorrectly. I also said it didn't describe how the universe began, hence why other theories were listed.

Also the name wasn't coined for the "less educated" either, but for its simplicity and to make it accessible to a wider audience, including those without extensive scientific backgrounds.