How Long Would the Zombie Apocalypse Really Last?

[MawlinRogue]

Very simple question, what do you think that gave zombies ability to move and react ?

The Brain - Gray matter in the brain controls sensory perception, muscle control, emotions, hearing, memory etc. So gray matter in the brain is obviously influenced in a very special way by Z1 (zombie virus). So even with the loss of its higher-brain functions the fact that it can still move and respond etc renew its 'warranty' right? Wrong.

Take for instance a Brown Recluse Spider's venom traveling along a limb through a vein or artery - the resulting tissue mortification can affect an area as large as several inches and in extreme cases require excising of the wound. When necrosis of tissues is a possibility in a healthy living organism, the same case holds true with a dead organism with base functions. Keep in mind, Z1 is still a pathogen and not a solution.

 

[keymon231]

The Brain - Gray matter in the brain controls sensory perception, muscle control, emotions, hearing, memory etc. So gray matter in the brain is obviously influenced in a very special way by Z1 (zombie virus). So even with the loss of its higher-brain functions the fact that it can still move and respond etc renew its 'warranty' right? Wrong.

I thought you said Zombies are brain dead mechanical creatures. Okay, so it's brain. On what condition a brain is able to carry out such complicated task? And does nervous system has anything to do with the muscle control you mentioned?

Take for instance a Brown Recluse Spider's venom traveling along a limb through a vein or artery - the resulting tissue mortification can affect an area as large as several inches and in extreme cases require excising of the wound. When necrosis of tissues is a possibility in a healthy living organism, the same case holds true with a dead organism with base functions. Keep in mind, Z1 is still a pathogen and not a solution.

Can a venom travels along veins and arteries if there were no bloodstream?

 

[MawlinRogue]

I thought you said Zombies are brain dead mechanical creatures. Okay, so it's brain.

Brain dead yes. Simplest example is a dead person twitching. Zombies are already dead are they not? Whatever actions or movements that follow post-dead can be surmised as prolonged Cadaveric spasm. So in that sense, brain dead yes.

On what condition a brain is able to carry out such complicated task? And does nervous system has anything to do with the muscle control you mentioned?

That would be the Z virus wont it? The nervous system is the part that coordinates the voluntary and involuntary actions of a person/organism and transmits signals between different parts of its body. That's basic biology come on!

Can a venom travels along veins and arteries if there were no bloodstream?

as I said if there were real zombies, they would be like human rabid dogs, with a working heart and lungs to circulate blood O2 to the brain and nervous system or the entire nervous and muscle system would simply die off within hours and render them unable to move, nor to twitch.

Seems you answered your own question.

 

[MawlinRogue]

i said gray matter in the brain is responsible for muscle control.

 

[keymon231]

Brain dead yes. Simplest example is a dead person twitching. Zombies are already dead are they not? Whatever actions or movements that follow post-dead can be surmised as prolonged Cadaveric spasm. So in that sense, brain dead yes.

Cadaveric spams occurs at the moment of death, it can't be prolonged. Even if you can, it's doesn't explain controlled movement ie to prey and feed. You can twitch a dead frog with 6 volts batteries electric jolt but only when it's nervous and muscle system are still function. After several hours, usually 3, it's no longer possible.

So gray matter in the brain is obviously influenced in a very special way by Z1 (zombie virus). So even with the loss of its higher-brain functions the fact that it can still move and respond etc renew its 'warranty' right? Wrong.

What special way? Even if I take that mythical special way as a legit answer, a brain still have to be alive to be influenced. Right? So, I'm completely lost here, please make up your mind. Are zombies brain dead creatures, or only loss their higher brain functions? It can't be both.

That would be the Z virus wont it? The nervous system is the part that coordinates the voluntary and involuntary actions of a person/organism and transmits signals between different parts of its body. That's basic biology come on!

You did not answer my question. We can't take 'in a certain way' or ' in a special way' as explanation. The virus is a myth, but human is not. We need scientific base explanation at least on the human side.

Let me put it this way.

Human body/ host = car
Virus = driver
Brain = Computerized electronical combustion system.
Skeleton = engine mounts, tires and drive system
Muscle = engine
Nerve = Wiring system to transmit command from the computer to the engine.
Electric impuls from brain to nervous system = gas

Now, can you tell me how to drive a car with a totally wrecked combustion system, no wiring, completely broken engine, no drive system and without a single drop of gas in the tank? You can't. You need gas, fully or partially working combustion system, wiring and engine and workable drive system to at least move the car. We are not talking about myth, like the flying VW Beetle in Harry Potter movie.

Seems you answered your own question.

The answer you were disagreed to.

 

[gman]

Could I just point out that 'electronical' is not a word and the car in the Harry Potter movies is not a VW Beetle, it's a Ford Anglia. Sorry to interrupt. Ok, back to the debate.

 

[barcelona]

Grey matter in the brain...........

 

[keymon231]

Could I just point out that 'electronical' is not a word

Only in English class, it's not.

and the car in the Harry Potter movies is not a VW Beetle, it's a Ford Anglia. Sorry to interrupt. Ok, back to the debate.

I know. I was trying to strengthen my point about something that does not exist. Anyway, thanks for dropping by.

 

[MawlinRogue]

Cadaveric spams occurs at the moment of death, it can't be prolonged. Even if you can, it's doesn't explain controlled movement ie to prey and feed. You can twitch a dead frog with 6 volts batteries electric jolt but only when it's nervous and muscle system are still function. After several hours, usually 3, it's no longer possible.

You misread. I am well aware that there is no such thing as prolonged cadaveric spasm. The actions or movements rendered by a dead corpse already infected with the Z virus can be termed as 'prolonged' cadaveric spasm for simplicity's sake.

What special way? Even if I take that mythical special way as a legit answer, a brain still have to be alive to be influenced. Right? So, I'm completely lost here, please make up your mind. Are zombies brain dead creatures, or only loss their higher brain functions? It can't be both. You did not answer my question. We can't take 'in a certain way' or ' in a special way' as explanation. The virus is a myth, but human is not. We need scientific base explanation at least on the human side.

The virus is a myth, but a human is not. Exactly. Which is why it is my understanding that a person once termed clinically dead there are no two ways about it. Necrosis is irreversible in the real world and no known virus can brings dead tissues to life (except in the reel world perhaps). The virus merely affects some parts of the dead brain to trigger base functions. I call it brain dead because the brain was never revived in the first place, only few portions influenced by the virus in a 'special way' (will get on to that next) till the brain liquefies.

You did not answer my question. We can't take 'in a certain way' or ' in a special way' as explanation. The virus is a myth, but human is not. We need scientific base explanation at least on the human side.

The fact that zombies can still see means that the the visual cortex (occipital lobe) has been tweaked/influenced whereas same higher brain functions like memory (frontal lobe), emotions, and speech (cerebral cortex) have been shut down.

Now, can you tell me how to drive a car with a totally wrecked combustion system, no wiring, completely broken engine, no drive system and without a single drop of gas in the tank? You can't. You need gas, fully or partially working combustion system, wiring and engine and workable drive system to at least move the car. We are not talking about myth, like the flying VW Beetle in Harry Potter movie.
The answer you were disagreed to.

Nopes i didnt answer. That was just to highlight the contradiction of your part on one of your earlier argument about bloodstream being essential later changing it for the sake of argument. I merely gave an example about the spider venom entering the bloodstream in a live human. Please ask serious questions. That was quite a comparison you gave but perhaps you should deliberate more about the decomposition/how-long will it last point rather than anything subjective.

 

[keymon231]

You misread. I am well aware that there is no such thing as prolonged cadaveric spasm. The actions or movements rendered by a dead corpse already infected with the Z virus can be termed as 'prolonged' cadaveric spasm for simplicity's sake.


The virus is a myth, but a human is not. Exactly. Which is why it is my understanding that a person once termed clinically dead there are no two ways about it. Necrosis is irreversible in the real world and no known virus can brings dead tissues to life (except in the reel world perhaps). The virus merely affects some parts of the dead brain to trigger base functions. I call it brain dead because the brain was never revived in the first place, only few portions influenced by the virus in a 'special way' (will get on to that next) till the brain liquefies.


The fact that zombies can still see means that the the visual cortex (occipital lobe) has been tweaked/influenced whereas same higher brain functions like memory (frontal lobe), emotions, and speech (cerebral cortex) have been shut down.


Nopes i didnt answer. That was just to highlight the contradiction of your part on one of your earlier argument about bloodstream being essential later changing it for the sake of argument. I merely gave an example about the spider venom entering the bloodstream in a live human. Please ask serious questions. That was quite a comparison you gave but perhaps you should deliberate more about the decomposition/how-long will it last point rather than anything subjective.

Let me simplify

1. Are zombies have function/ partially function brain? ( yes / no )
2. Are zombies have function/ partially function nervous system? ( yes / no )

 

[MawlinRogue]

Let me simplify

1. Are zombies have function/ partially function brain? ( yes / no )
2. Are zombies have function/ partially function nervous system? ( yes / no )

1.decomposing brain.
2.decomposing nervous system.
Hence will rot and wither eventually.
Now, tell me without deviating from pragmatic and in scientific terms how did you theorize that since they feed they can last forever or till food supply lasts?

 

[keymon231]

Now, tell me without deviating from pragmatic and in scientific terms how did you theorize that since they feed they can last forever or till food supply lasts?

I did not say they can, I said they might. Okay, back to the page 1.

1. If they feed, they need food. If they need food, that means they have physiology process running in their body and cells regeneration that need to be fueled. If a creature does not need to eat, brain would not give such order to do so. It's biology 101.

2. They hunt when they feed. This can only be done if they have a function/ partially function brain, nervous system and muscle.

In order to maintain a working muscle and nervous system for a ( or an unlimited ) period of time, vascular system must exist to supply blood O2 and nutrition. This process greatly decrease the decay rate, or may even stop it from happening if the whole process runs properly. This is why I said zombies might lasts way longer than you think.

1.decomposing brain.
2.decomposing nervous system.
Hence will rot and wither eventually.

Once the nerve system died or permanently injured, movement is no longer possible ( ie patients with neck down paralysis ) let alone in decomposing stage. Decomposing muscle movement is also not possible because muscle movement involves complex cellular processes and enzymes which only possible with living muscle tissue.

Human nervous and muscle system die off completely in several hours after death. A moving body with dead and decomposing nerve and broken muscle system is like a car running without engine and gas, it would be as ridiculous as the flying "VW Beetle" in Harry Potter movie. Localized necrosis by the virus toxin also unacceptable because necrotizing tissues and body parts can not move.

 

[tracher999]

i hope long anouch there are to many people on this fucking earth

 

[MawlinRogue]

I did not say they can, I said they might. Okay, back to the page 1.

1. If they feed, they need food. If they need food, that means they have physiology process running in their body and cells regeneration that need to be fueled. If a creature does not need to eat, brain would not give such order to do so. It's biology 101.

2. They hunt when they feed. This can only be done if they have a function/ partially function brain, nervous system and muscle.

In order to maintain a working muscle and nervous system for a ( or an unlimited ) period of time, vascular system must exist to supply blood O2 and nutrition. This process greatly decrease the decay rate, or may even stop it from happening if the whole process runs properly. This is why I said zombies might lasts way longer than you think.

So the key to decrease/stop decaying tissue is to have a partial brain function, nervous system, muscle and a fuel for the brain to carry out the commands function and you are all set! But how will the food ingested get absorbed into the blood stream without a digestive system? So let's include that also as a key component for zombie survival mode 101. Wait, digestion of the food also and requires the wetting contact of saliva. No problem, salivary glands checked. The list goes on. Digestion of food sure sounded much easier in a living person than on a dead one. So with so much organs required just to sustain a dead zombie - the stakes seem so much higher for it. Seems to kill a zombie head shot no longer needed. You can now also shoot the heart that pumps O2 to the brain and its dead dead. If by design (wrath of nature or man-made) zombies were engineered to be the device for our demise, it shouldn't make things more complicated to come and "bite them in the ass"(pun intended).

Once the nerve system died or permanently injured, movement is no longer possible ( ie patients with neck down paralysis ) let alone in decomposing stage. Decomposing muscle movement is also not possible because muscle movement involves complex cellular processes and enzymes which only possible with living muscle tissue.

Human nervous and muscle system die off completely in several hours after death. A moving body with dead and decomposing nerve and broken muscle system is like a car running without engine and gas, it would be as ridiculous as the flying "VW Beetle" in Harry Potter movie. Localized necrosis by the virus toxin also unacceptable because necrotizing tissues and body parts can not move.

First part, So not a zombie at all, just a dead corpse rotting in the sun am i right?

Secondly. So you are saying that it should therefore have full muscle system, effective nerve system and never-say-die brain/attitude right rather than a decaying corpse. That's not really a zombie now, is it?

 

[MawlinRogue]

i hope long anouch there are to many people on this fucking earth

the reason is justified.

 

[keymon231]

So the key to decrease/stop decaying tissue is to have a partial brain function, nervous system, muscle and a fuel for the brain to carry out the commands function and you are all set! But how will the food ingested get absorbed into the blood stream without a digestive system? So let's include that also as a key component for zombie survival mode 101. Wait, digestion of the food also and requires the wetting contact of saliva. No problem, salivary glands checked. The list goes on. Digestion of food sure sounded much easier in a living person than on a dead one. So with so much organs required just to sustain a dead zombie - the stakes seem so much higher for it. Seems to kill a zombie head shot no longer needed. You can now also shoot the heart that pumps O2 to the brain and its dead dead. If by design (wrath of nature or man-made) zombies were engineered to be the device for our demise, it shouldn't make things more complicated to come and "bite them in the ass"(pun intended).


First part, So not a zombie at all, just a dead corpse rotting in the sun am i right?

Secondly. So you are saying that it should therefore have full muscle system, effective nerve system and never-say-die brain/attitude right rather than a decaying corpse. That's not really a zombie now, is it?

Yup, now you understand what I said @page 2 and why I say that.

If zombie apocalypse could happen in our real life, I can tell you that it would not be the same as what we've seen in the movies. The real zombies would be almost fully functional living organism, only without emotion and very least intelligent that falls way under smart mammals. Rabid dogs in human form to describe.

Other kind of zombies are myth and impossible

 

[keymon231]

 

[tracher999]

the reason is justified.

iff you are intrestet in zombie survival check this http://www.zombiehunters.org/forum/index.php

 

[MawlinRogue]

Yup, now you understand what I said @page 2 and why I say that.

That's why the threat is not going to last that much long as the movie makes us think. I can understand your viewpoint too.

 

[MawlinRogue]

iff you are intrestet in zombie survival check this http://www.zombiehunters.org/forum/index.php

No human survivors left there. That place is infested with hordes of zombies! yikes