Low pay is not ok (1 Viewer)

[McM]

 

[MajorWhiteBoy]

Agreed.

Massachusetts just said that by 2016, they will be raising minimum wage from $8 to $11 dollars an hour. That is going to destroy small businesses. Fucking idiots.

By 2016, a fucking hamburger will cost 11 bucks.

 

[sillyrabbit]

Our government is becoming excellent at fucking up our economy. In 2008 the business's that put wage freezes in place so they didnt have to downsize are the business's responsible for maintaining some stability in that economy. Some of those freezes are still in place. One is the minimum wage, and should not be revised until the gov debts are paid. Im not paying $10. For a mcmuffin. People are not going to pay for any of the "shit" you buy at a store where min wage people work. Chances are, its not a necessity, and
nobodys going to miss it. So folds another business.....and so on. And if i know this....maybe i should apply for a job on the budget committee.

 

[sillyrabbit]

Sorry for rambling

 

[D.O.A.]

People at McDonald's are not college graduates. What skills do they possess? They deserve no more than they are already making.

Anything below living standards is slave labour. McFucktards make Mcbillions off that processed dog food they sell so I see no reason the workers should be reliant on the TAXPAYER to subsidise the cost of living while selling hamburgers full time for some cunt corporation. does that make sense to you?

 

[D.O.A.]

Agreed.

Massachusetts just said that by 2016, they will be raising minimum wage from $8 to $11 dollars an hour. That is going to destroy small businesses. Fucking idiots.

Ours is bare minimum $16.88 an hour. $20 is average. unemployment rate at 5.7%

problem?

 

[SAF]

Agreed.

Massachusetts just said that by 2016, they will be raising minimum wage from $8 to $11 dollars an hour. That is going to destroy small businesses. Fucking idiots.

This state is so fucking retarded. Just keep catering to the welfare trash. Keep them voting democrat.

 

[Mr_Blonde]

the cost of living has outgrown the economy.

You got it backwards. Reader's Digest version.
All world economies, US, Asian, and EU are playing race to the bottom. (guess what Africa won a long time ago.) All nations are printing the shit out of their currency to lessen the strain of debt and cover the immense cost of entitlements. Only one country can do this with lessened damage, the one which holds the world's reserve currency. At this time, and I guess for not for too much longer thanks to Obunghole, it is the US Greenback. Since the EU cannot effectively print their own money on a scale in which they need to they are now going to try a scheme called "devaluing."
--
http://www.newyorkfed.org/aboutthefed/fedpoint/fed38.html
For example, suppose a government has set 10 units of its currency equal to one dollar. To devalue, it might announce that from now on 20 of its currency units will be equal to one dollar. This would make its currency half as expensive to Americans, and the U.S. dollar twice as expensive in the devaluing country. To revalue, the government might change the rate from 10 units to one dollar to five units to one dollar; this would make the currency twice as expensive to Americans, and the dollar half as costly at home.

Under What Circumstances Might a Country Devalue?When a government devalues its currency, it is often because the interaction of market forces and policy decisions has made the currency's fixed exchange rate untenable. In order to sustain a fixed exchange rate, a country must have sufficient foreign exchange reserves, often dollars, and be willing to spend them, to purchase all offers of its currency at the established exchange rate. When a country is unable or unwilling to do so, then it must devalue its currency to a level that it is able and willing to support with its foreign exchange reserves.

A key effect of devaluation is that it makes the domestic currency cheaper relative to other currencies. There are two implications of a devaluation. First, devaluation makes the country's exports relatively less expensive for foreigners. Second, the devaluation makes foreign products relatively more expensive for domestic consumers, thus discouraging imports. This may help to increase the country's exports and decrease imports, and may therefore help to reduce the current account deficit.

----
This little scheme only works if only one country is doing it. Problem is when one country does it, another doesn't want to weaken it's export strength due to the 'over-value' of its exports into that country so it devalues its currency also. And again, race to the bottom.

Thanks to the socialist Obunghole and his Jewish buddy Soros the world is now truly fucked. 10% unemployment is now the new low.

 

[aptlyNamed]

so the US isn't devaluing? that means there would be no change in the cost of imports/exports? i'd certainly hope not since we seem to love importing fucking everything. companies have no national allegiance. their only allegiance is to money and that makes them potentially dangerous. the reason i said it was the cost of living was because i was thinking about how nothing is really made here anymore. it's all outsourced and then imported since it's cheaper to do it that way. how did it get like that!? obviously, the cost of living is too high here (or the expected quality of life), so our workers require more pay than workers in other countries + the cost to ship the products. that does leave a question, though. and that's: how did it get that way?

unfortunately, the only way to beat globalization is if all Western nations which import cheap foreign shit boycott that cheap foreign shit. otherwise, there's too much competition. if one does it, than all the others are going to have to do it too.

 

[D.O.A.]

Mr_Blonde here's a recent piece from our ex foreigner minister, it's a double edged sword.

The effects of our currency falling against the US dollar will benefit some sectors, but not all, writes Alexander Downer.
... Now that sounds a bit odd these days. I mean, you and I know Australia can't change the weather.

And the whole issue of climate change just isn't as fashionable as it once was.

What is? That the Australian dollar is too strong - though it has weakened a fair bit in recent weeks.

It's the reason our car companies are struggling, it's the reason Spring Gully got into trouble, it's the reason Trims went into receivership, its the reason . . and so on and so forth.

It's a fashion.

But honestly, is it the truth?

Well, let's think about why the dollar has been strong. For a start, Australia has been doing OK compared to the US, the UK and the Eurozone. The GFC, as they like to call it, was essentially a transatlantic phenomenon.

It destroyed a number of American and European banks, which had to be bailed out by governments.

But it had almost no impact on our well-regulated banks.

What is more, our major trading partners are in Asia and they weren't too badly affected by the GFC. So these two things meant the Australian dollar was a better option than the US dollar, the euro and the pound.

That's changing a little bit now as the US recovery is slowly getting under way, Britain is spluttering towards recovery and Japan is on the uptake, though the Eurozone is still in recession. So against the US dollar, the pound and even the embattled euro, the Australian dollar is softening a bit. The current fashion is to tell you that is a good thing.

I'm not entirely sure.

Let's be negative about this since that is counter-intuitive. Imported products are now startng to become more expensive. Some of those products are common or garden consumer items such as iPads and mobile phones, televisions and DVDs, most of the clothes in our shops and children's toys.

We don't make these things in Australia so now that the dollar is sinking, remember, a big proportion of what you buy is going to become more expensive.

That will, in a phrase, reduce your standard of living.

And then there is petrol. You've become used to a price for unleaded of about $1.50 a litre, maybe a little less. Well, a lower dollar is going to push that up. If the dollar sinks to, say, 85 cents, which I think it will, then petrol will slide up to around $1.70. That's not a disaster, but it will make you poorer.

Then there's this. Imports are an important contributor to business inputs. Most of the components in the Australian assembled Holden Cruze are imported. So as the dollar goes down, so the cost of those inputs goes up.

And since imports make up far more than 50 per cent of the cost of building the Holden Cruze, a falling dollar will make Australian-built cars more expensive.

The same is true of many other inputs in manufacturing industry.

For example, machine tools are largely made overseas, in countries such as America, Japan and Germany. With a falling dollar they're going to be more expensive.

Now you can easily counter this by saying that farmers' returns will be higher because of a falling dollar, so will miners', and Australia will become cheaper for tourists and students. This is incontestably true. But my point is that devaluation is not a simple formula for economic prosperity. It's a boon to some industries and a burden for others.

Back in the 1960s, the British economy was struggling. So the government of the day, presided over by Harold Wilson, decided formally to devalue the currency. It was a failure. Imports were more expensive and exports were cheaper, sure. That sounds good. But imported business inputs became more expensive as did imported consumer goods.

The effect of the devaluation was negligible. The British economy continued to struggle until the 1980s when the government forced massive macro and micro economic reforms through the parliament.

By the 1990s, Britain had put the slough of the 60s, and 70s behind it. Sure, it's not going so well now, but that's not because of the pound.

It's because the Brown government overspent and the Eurozone - Britain's biggest export market - went pear-shaped.

My guess is the Australian dollar will shed another 10 cents against the US dollar - that is, it will go down to 85 cents. Remember, back in 2001, the dollar went down to 50 cents against the US dollar. So its highs of more than a dollar to the US dollar are unusual.

But don't think the depreciation of the Australian dollar against the America dollar is some sort of economic panacea.

Ten per cent onto the cost of a Volkswagen because of currency depreciation isn't going to ruin their Australian market for that German car company. People like their cars. They're cool and they work well.

Our problem is we've started to fall into the trap of Harold Wilson's England. Unions are front and centre of our manufacturing so costs are astronomical while productivity is low. We need to face up to the fact that you can sell products at high prices if they are good.

Be honest. Some of our manufactured products, especially cars, are just not what consumers want. It's not price alone, its quality.

Forget the dollar; it won't save us through devaluation. High quality products will.

Alexander Downer was foreign affairs minister in the Howard government from 1996 to 2007.

http://www.adelaidenow.com.au/news/...onomys-salvation/story-e6freabc-1226655419869

 

[MajorWhiteBoy]

Ours is bare minimum $16.88 an hour. $20 is average. unemployment rate at 5.7%

problem?

A piece of that puzzle is missing. I know exactly turtle shit fuck all about Australia, but your economy, i would guess, is structured so very differently from ours its apples and orangutans.

 

[D.O.A.]

A piece of that puzzle is missing. I know exactly turtle shit fuck all about Australia, but your economy, i would guess, is structured so very differently from ours its apples and orangutans.

very true, living on $8 per hour or so here would be impossible. I can't even park in the city for one hour for 8 bucks

 

[D.O.A.]

A piece of that puzzle is missing. I know exactly turtle shit fuck all about Australia, but your economy, i would guess, is structured so very differently from ours its apples and orangutans.

I think you'd probably find our unions impossible to deal with, seen as one side of government is basically made up of former union bosses, the GFC didn't really reach us and we sell so much iron, uranium and shit to china etc it's not funny... the economy has only just gone into debt because of the former government throwing money around, but now we have a party that is very anal with cash and usually delivers a surplus in the budget after a while. It's a cyclical thing here between the two leading parties. Spend/Save. Minimum wages are set by a government appointed body and you can't pay a cent less. All employers must kick in 9% of your pay, on top of your pay into superannuation (retirement) package.

As of August 2013, Australians have over $1.6 trillion in superannuation assets.[6] Australians now have more money invested in managed funds per capita than any other economy.[7]
Compulsory superannuation in combination with buoyant economic growth has turned Australia into a 'shareholder society', where most workers are now indirect investors in the stock market. Consequently, a lively personal investment marketplace has developed, and many Australians take an interest in investment topics.

Unemployment is like 5.7%, youwant a job I'll get you one lol. It's pretty good here at the moment, but of course we're deep in Americas ass also so we're always watching where you're heading.

 

[Mr_Blonde]

Mr_Blonde here's a recent piece from our ex foreigner minister, it's a double edged sword.

Always did like the attitude of the Ozzies but, there is one mitigating factor. In the game of 'the bottom line," eventually it comes down to the "bottom line." That's why many of the great names in machining like Cincinnati, Monarch, LeBlonde and SouthBend have faltered against and some collapsed against the tidal wave of cheap, lower quality Chinese products.

For example, if you are a contractor, and in this uncertain economy, are you going to spend 400 dollars on a Milwaukee Drill or opt for the cheap $70 Ryobi? Ok you may have to replace the Ryobi 10 times over the lifespan of the Milwaukee and eventually spend more but, the cost is deferred longer over time. Now use this same model when purchasing $40,000 machines or assembly robots and I think you can get the idea.

Western companies cannot compete with China because the Chinese Gov. controlled wages. If a country like China can manufacture, ship and market a product for LESS than US prison labor which I believe make something like 40 cents an hour there is something grotesquely wrong.

The standard counter to that was the import tariff, which introduced it's own set of problems but, since China is America's and subsequently, the world's most favored trade nation (facepalm) it is highly unlikely anything will change unless the western governments force a change which is obvious it won't happen because we are now addicted to cheap cheaply made products.

I cannot speak for Aussieland but, in the US it seems all of the products, including the American brand are assembled in China. Many cannot tell but, more astute persons have noticed the subtle changes in quality. Ray-Bands sunglasses are a prime example.

 

[mrln]

I cannot speak for Aussieland but, in the US it seems all of the products, including the American brand are assembled in China. Many cannot tell but, more astute persons have noticed the subtle changes in quality. Ray-Bands sunglasses are a prime example.

red wing work boots also now.

 

[Mr_Blonde]

so the US isn't devaluing? .

Technically yes and no.
Is our currency being devalued by Ben "Finger pointing money manipulator" Bernanke and now Jack "Mr. Loopy" Lew though the disastrous plan devised by Timothy "Angry gay elf of Mordor" Geightner through the massive printing of money. QE1, something like 800-900B. QE2, 500-600B QE3 1.1T and now QE4-evah 89B a MONTH (going on for about 2 years now. (do your own math homework ) Now I know the progressive leftist all will pipe in and say they are NOT printing money just adjusting the balance sheets electronically. Well these balances or bonds which are being bought with "electronic dollars" do eventually get introduced into the market as real fiat currency because if one has money in the bank, eventually they will want to spend, invest or lend it.

The US has lost nearly a penny a month against the Euro since one vowel from "nagger" was elected president.

The US can get away with this only when US Dollar is the world reserve currency. Once the G8 which have been holding private meetings WITHOUT the US agree to make the Chinese Yuan the WRC. The Obunghole Administration is the single most destructive force the world has ever seen -- more than WWII more than the pandemic flu outbreak.

What it has done was make a recession labor employment, manufacturing and investment numbers now the new norm, reduce single-handely the purchasing power of the average American family by 35% which means we can't buy Earl Grey tea or French wine or what ever. Remember the US market called the shots for so long because it was the single most largest market. The EU has usurped that title but due to the formation of the EU. But, as predicted Germany and Britain are now under tremendous strain because of all of the weaker nations and are now buckling under the weight of supporting the EU. Obunghole has handed the Chinese a compete and total victory in the trade war.

 

[revolva]

Sure, MacDonalds workers may not make the short list of achievers, but they're just people doing what they're capable of and in some cases, less than capable of. I'm never gonna convince many here otherwise, so I'll leave it at that and just add that no matter what level of employment people are at, they all deserve a fair break and to be treated with dignity.....sadly the opposite is our reality. Chinese sweatshop wage slavery is the model being adopted all over the world and the message is, "Suck on it!" The choice is accept this insult or lose your job altogether! The fact that people actually tacitly agree with this in that they also pound the shit out of these down trodden serfs, shows that they don't really understand the scope of the problem. They assume they're not also included in this corporate model of 'how it's gonna be!!' Greed is greed and it's full spectrum!! First MacD's and next your company!
What they're doing is passing of a percentage of the financial responsibility for running a business onto the taxpayers and saying, "We don't want to foot the cost of running of our company, but we want to reap the full profit it generates. This is the way the elite want the entire planet to to be eventually. If we don't step up and defend the rights of the MacD's workers as if they're our own, we're like someone sitting in a room that's caught fire and saying my side of the room's fine so why should I get up and help you put out your side?

 

[Mr_Blonde]

If we don't step up and defend the rights of the MacD's as if they're our own, we're like someone sitting in a room that's caught fire and saying my side of the room's fine so why should I get up and help you put out your side?

What are the ramifications of paying someone a "living wage" $15/hr for saying "Hello welcome to ___________. May I take your order. " Think about it. If these hapless McD employees hate the 8/hr wage so bad then get another job. A day laborer makes 10/hr. An office temp or CSR makes typically 9/hr as a training wage and if are on time for six months are bumped to 12/hr. Telemarketers make 8/hr and get commissions. Waiters and waitresses often make 12/hr or more. Car salesmen often make minimum wage along with a $50-100 minimum per sale.

So --- really? How about that's the only job they can get or want because they like the low responsibility, flexible hours and work that needs little or no mental capabilities.

 

[McM]

It's the way 'capitalism' works, but correct treatment of employees should be standard.

 

[revolva]

What are the ramifications of paying someone a "living wage" $15/hr for saying "Hello welcome to ___________. May I take your order. " Think about it. If these hapless McD employees hate the 8/hr wage so bad then get another job. A day laborer makes 10/hr. An office temp or CSR makes typically 9/hr as a training wage and if are on time for six months are bumped to 12/hr. Telemarketers make 8/hr and get commissions. Waiters and waitresses often make 12/hr or more. Car salesmen often make minimum wage along with a $50-100 minimum per sale.

So --- really? How about that's the only job they can get or want because they like the low responsibility, flexible hours and work that needs little or no mental capabilities.

You're missing the point. All you've done is list jobs where the same sweatshop mentality has already taken over and used them to justify not helping another group. Dissing the job they do or their reasons for being there as if it's beneath you is also not really an answer, just you venting your dislike for a certain sector of the labor force....if we were to use your argument we could ridicule just about any job.....
Receptionist: Good morning (............)'s office how may I help you?
Supermarket checkout worker: Beep........beep.........beep.........
Train driver: Go forward......stop........go forward........stop

Fact is, the main reason for taking a job for the vast majority is that they're doing what they're forced to do in order to get money to live. Making fun of their skill level is just cold and ignorant in my opinion and again we could all be the target of that in the relative world of labor skills. The vast majority of us wouldn't choose to be working 8, 9, 10, 11....or in my case 14 hours a day just to get the bare necessities of survival. We're forced into that position by a corrupt banking oligarchy that has structured the worlds finances to make us all completely dependent. Low wages equals control.